Gamecock's Mind over Money

Happy Thanksgiving to all!! I am really proud of us all for being very frugal while putting thought and effort into the holidays to make it special. Memories don't cost a thing!

Enjoy your days off from work...and try to give the turkey's a nice day too...maybe not buy a turkey?...save some cash?

eBay has slowed down to a point it's agonizing listing items!! WHAT is going on??

3 days ago I listed items all day and as I was listing I was habitually checking my auctions and NOTHING!! No messages, no bids no watchers! So weird- I'm used to lots of action on my stuff.

And the weirdness has continued...the past two days the activity has been really disappointing. 2 days ago all my ending auctions sold for the opening bid...and today 3 of my 5 auctions DIDN'T SELL AT ALL!

I am guessing that people are holding off shopping till black Friday...and they are not even going on ebay to avoid the temptation...

or it's because I stopped selling gift-y items (I ran out/sold it all) like the swarovski and strongwater stuff...I moved onto pottery and dishware. And dishware isn't exactly something you need to spend money on at the holidays.



But I have started listing the Lenox china this week and it's also not taking off as I hoped it would. C'mon eBayers...don't you need china for all your holiday parties? (Though it recently occurred to me that I should have listed Lenox two weeks ago when people would have been looking to have items shipped in time for their Thanksgiving dinners...sigh. you cant win them all.

Oh well...$4 is better than $0 and the place is getting cleared out in preparation to maybe move soon...3 Tupperware bins are empty in the garage...4 more to go!

I paid off the computer on the 0% Bestbuy card. I have 10 more months of 0% interest, but I have the money now and don't want it on the credit report. So that's done.

Working on bank pre-approval for a mortgage. I initially went on lendingtree a few months ago and was pre-approved within a few hours...but it didn't feel legitimate. We are somewhat risky on paper and they just didn't ask enough questions... I don't want to start a house buying process to have the financing fall through.

So we went to WAMU and have the opposite problem. They are very non-personal and are only looking at a certain set of numbers and not listening to the explanations we provide around the numbers. After waiting almost 2 weeks I get an email asking me to provide an explanation for purchasing a primary residence in GA when BB is contracted to work in TX.They also asked why BB worked for 4 different companies in a span of 6 months...("its not companies! It's teams!") they are not really taking our situation into account. They keep saying BB was "fired" when he was traded...Thats a blow to the self esteem to hear (trading is good! Firing is bad! Dont label me fired!)...Then they also want an explanation for buying a duplex rather than a SFH. BB just got fired up at their emails and then no response attitude.

So we are now working with a woman in GA who so far is friendly, listens and works hard. We just priority mailed off our paperwork to her so hopefully we will have a pre-approval that I feel comfortable with in a week or two.

So that is 3 agencies who have checked our credit in the last 3 weeks...our excellent credit is our most valuable asset at this point and I do get nervous allowing all these people to check the credit but it is what it is.

The woman in GA of course asked all our income and sadly I couldn't talk about ebay without IRS problems-which is too bad because I have been earning a normal middle class salary off of ebay. oh well- I will keep earning and the lender will keep asking where all this money keeps coming from and I will just keep saying I am downsizing to move to the smaller space. Which is true. I'm just downsizing pretty hardcore.

Well, I just added a couple thousand to my house savings fund...and the house we want just lowered their price AGAIN! by $13,000.

Seller is suddenly motivated. $26,000 price drop in 2 months.

Our duplex is now at a very reasonable price and I am panicked someone will snatch it up. I was counting on that "just a tad unreasonable" price to scare away buyers.

We are still going through the pre approval process so we are not in a position to put in an offer yet.

Hopefully the stars will align soon.

Possibly ignorant question...but people always make remarks such as "oh you are only making interest payments at this point" when you say that you made a payment on your mortgage if you are a new homeowner.

Mortgages- why is it that you are paying primarily interest in the beginning of your loan, and more principal as you pay the loan down?

I would think that if you get a mortgage for $100,000 @ 6% for 30yrs...I would think the bank divided $100,000 by 360 months (length of loan) =$277 and then charged 6.0% interest on the $277.00....but the mortgage calculator says the monthly payment is $600.00...why??

So I just called the renter on the property I inherited across the country and left her a voice mail. She and her daughter have been living in the place for the last...5 years? 6 years?...and when I inherited the property the renter had been there many years already and no lease was in place. It's a standard "I take care of you, you take care of me." agreement.

I chose to keep that agreement going so as to not rattle the boat. An excellent renter is an excellent renter. And she has been excellent.

Now with the possibility of buying a house, the darn bank is red taping everything up by asking for a lease.

This leaves me to grapple with some questions I have been delaying to think about:

1. Did the renter ever pay a security deposit when she moved in? I don't know. I have not asked her because well really- what kind of answer am I going to get? "Of course I paid a deposit! First AND last months rent."

2. And then there is the guilt that she has been living in a 1980's property that has never been renovated. When she tells me an appliance has broken she buys the new item and sends me a receipt. Other than that- no changes. Same carpeting, fixtures..everything. I feel like a slumlord- I have never even had the carpets cleaned in it.

So I guess right now I don't want to rock the boat. I am afraid to ask her long term plans because...in this buyers market real estate climate after she has been renting so many years...I am afraid to hear the answer.

I am afraid to ask about the security deposit because I am afraid she will think "I have several thousand dollars coming to me in the form of a security deposit"...and get ideas about moving to a more modern updated place.

And I am afraid she wants to move and I have to take my house down payment money and move across the country for a few weeks to renovate it while debating to sell it in this bad market or pay a management company to find me a new tenant. And from reading the blogs on here- dream tenants are hard to find. If I decide to keep the place then the down payment money I spent on renovations is gone...and no buying a house.

Sigh. I know calling the tenant and clearing the air is the right thing to do. The responsible thing to do. I am just really afraid of the answers.

I have $11.00 in "cash back points" on my Discover card. The card has $0 balance and cash back points can only be deducted in multiples of twenty. I need to figure out a way to purchase an item- build my points up to 20 and then apply those to the card and pay it off. This way I can get the $11 I 'earned'.

But Discover is tricky- giving you double points on certain purchases and so forth.

I would need to be very careful one purchase at a time then going online to see the new points balance before making another purchase.

I don't want to get into a situation where I need to go through this all again because of an extra few dollars in points left on the card.

I cant believe this is one of the more prevalent topics on my mind right now. I need to get a life.

I am listing like a mad woman on eBay. Once I broke through the "Its only worth a few dollars" barrier I realized I have TONS more things to sell on ebay!

DisneySteve's motto "sell anything that is not nailed down" is my mantra.

BB and I are serious about putting in an offer by christmas and I:

1. dont want to PAY to move all this stuff across state lines

2. every dollar helps!

So I have been going through boxes in the garage. The house looks like a tornado right now but I feel so satisfied that I can ALMOST envision the amount of stuff we will be moving!

Before it was so overwhelming thinking we would be moving bins, boxes and cases of stuff with us only to take it from the garage here and move it into the attic there.

Every listing added makes me feel so much 'free-er'.

BTW- wildlife removal man came by and set armadillo traps. I THINK he will not kill the little guy- he said if we trap him, to move it to our back porch and blanket the trap to keep him warm because its getting cold at night and they don't have much body heat. -So I don't think the man would be concerned with the armadillos comfort only to turn around a kill it.

We have an Armadillo living under our house. I think it's hilarious. BB and I are both from New England and these weird looking nocturnal rodents/animals? are such a conversation starter for us. "oh look! An Armadillo!!"

Now we have one that chose to make his home underneath our house. So cute!

Sadly...we have to remove our new neighbor. I have no problem letting him stay but am afraid of him causing foundation issues if he lives there for several years. (After some research I learned they dig a home and live there for their lifetime.) I worry this guy has human-like qualities and will soon think his home is too small and dig a larger and deeper hole. And maybe a family will be born there and they will need a bigger and deeper home still. And then in 5 years half of the house is tilted as it sinks into this hole!

So I called a trapper to come out this weekend. They PROMISE they will humanely trap him and release him into the wild. If their website says they are no kill-then they are no kill-right?

The trapper wants $450 to remove the little guy. So for $450 they better not kill him.

I'm already attached to him. I feel honored that he feels secure enough to make a home underneath me. I feel very guilty for calling the removal service. He didn't do anything to me. Now I'm going to invade his home and cause all this trauma to him.

LUCKILY as a RENTER...this is not $450 coming out of my pocket. Landlord takes care of this bill. Makes me relieved that I don't own a home! I need to hang onto this feeling.

In a continued effort to clean out the house to prepare for an eventual move when we buy a house...I listed a bunch of broken electronics on eBay today.

Several Sony cameras if anyone needs a broken camera. I don't know who would...but they are on ebay if you want em!

Funny how things just accumulate because an item breaks and it gets stored away instead of being thrown away when it is replaced.

I have a bunch of old cell phones I need to rehome now....

I got nothing big to report so I will blog about a small stroke of luck or the trickery I used to double my ebay earnings today. Not sure which way to interpret the events.

Weeks ago I listed a barbie doll MINT in original box for $10...item did not sell. I was not surprised, this barbie was not selling for $5 in most auctions. (I don't know why I listed the doll for $10 in the face of knowing it would not sell)

I relisted the item again for $10 on the off chance that the Christmas season might draw out a bidder.

Well after 6 days of no bidders or watchers I finally got a bidder 1 day before auction ends.

That night the bidder emails me telling me it is her daughter who placed the bid who did not know the mother already purchased the same doll for a Christmas gift. I tell the woman that if she wins the auction I will file a "mutual retraction" so she does not need to pay for the item. I was too lazy to look up how to cancel a bid and decided to just wait for the auction to end and cancel the transaction then.

Well lo and behold- 10 minutes before the auction ends a person bids on the doll. The bids were unsuccessful because the little girl who hijacked the account bid up to $20.00. So this second bidder bid the barbie all the way up to $21.00!!

So that is my story of how I managed to double my ebay earnings by being lazy...or I used trickery to manipulate someone out there in ebayland into paying double the worth of the item.

I am not sure if it is my lucky day or I should feel guilty.

BB's Xbox 360 has been freezing up and eventually froze up so much BB gave up and bought a new one. Is the old one worth anything to anyone?

I appreciate all the input regarding our plans to buy a duplex. Hearing about trashed houses and selling for a loss due to poor upkeep was a little sad to hear! But it's important information for me to know about when pursuing this plan.

We are going to stick with it (our plan to buy a duplex). We wont be able to get a mortgage for a property without the rental income provided from the duplex.

BB and I were going through our tax info today to get the paperwork in order for the mortgage application...BB made $5,000 in 2006. $5,000!! I don't know how we lived. No wonder I was always on his case to quit baseball and get a different job. He made $10,000 last year...he is gloating that he doubled his income-I am gloating that we lived a normal life off that income! Plus we also had my rental income of $14,000 last year.

I'm not sure how we live like we make middle class money when we made $24,000 this year...I REALLY don't know how we lived normally when he was making $5,000 a year.)

If I knew how we stretch the money then I would write a book. Titled "How to live off of $25,000 a year but feel like you make $40,000." But our lifestyle and I guess our income level is so normal to us that I feel like we live a normal life. We only miss out on the Big extravagances in life. I guess all those scrimping and living frugal secrets really add up!

Anyways- I am afraid to show the bank our taxes from the past two years because I think the lender handler will turn pale and start talking about how maybe we are not ready to buy a house right now...LOL. Even I didn't realize we make so little money.

So we'll see what they say. Who knows.

In other news- my stupid camera broke and I had to buy a new one today. I'm in the middle of the eBay crunch before Christmas and cant afford to even go a week without listing items. grrr...so I am $170 poorer.

Well, I got houses on the brain. Yesterday the house we are interested in buying dropped another 10k in price. The owner has dropped the price $24,000 since it went on the market over 6 months ago. Good news- but I think there is still room to negotiate.

I'm sure nobody cares to hear me going on about this house...but here I go anyways. Writing out my thoughts helps me organize my thoughts.

The house is actually a duplex. Baseball boy and I have been looking at duplexes since we discovered that actively rented duplexes are counted as your income when applying for a mortgage. We have always 'talked' of owning real estate and making our income that way...but we always talked of buying a house and renting it out later when we upgraded. Now we have our sights set on first a duplex-later a single family home.

For us it seems to make sense:
The 2nd unit will pay a majority of the mortgage (helpful when I am unemployed, BB is underemployed).

Both units can be easily rented out if we decide to travel, move, whatever.

Repairs, taxes and improvements made to the rental unit is tax deductible!

The income allows us to have an income..but not have to work 9-5 everyday so BB can continue to play ball.

If we mess up the fixing-upping of one unit we can rent it out and move into the other unit and try decorating again!(mess up- as in: choose bad paint colors or ugly tiles).

Duplexes tend to cost just 50% over the cost of a SFH...so you get 2 units for 1.5x the price.

This duplex currently has the bottom floor unit rented for the next 8 months for $995 a month. We are HOPING to get the house for about $210k...leaving us to just cover the remaining taxes, insurance ect by a couple hundred dollars.

This house is one of the uglier houses on the block. There are some uglier ones...but this house is by no means the biggest or most impressive. BB is talking a lot about changing the trim paint colors from brown to white...and claims that will really help the curb appeal. I think maybe some sod will help the curb appeal. Actually, I think re-boxing in the front doors will really help the curb appeal.

The house is in a very desirable area. I'm surprised we can afford this location. It's 5 blocks from the big central park in the city, 2 blocks from a grocery store and 2 blocks to a cute shopping area, and a few blocks from the local big college.

A bit about the house:
The house has an UGLY outdated kitchen and bathroom. This way there will be no guilt from ripping out cabinets just to put in cabinets to fit my taste. And the backyard is way overgrown with weeds and junk. There is a metal garage in the backyard that basically looks like it MIGHT fall down soon. BB wants to immediately redo our kitchen and bath...but I actually explained that if we buy this place then my first priority is landscaping the backyard and securing/fixing the garage up. I want to do these things FIRST because if you dont do them when you first move in...you just never end up doing it. Until it's time to sell and you realize "Gee! That garage out back would be a real selling feature for the house if only it was not overgrown with weeds!" But I figure the kitchen and bath will eventually get redone because every time we walk into the room we will have a replaying fantasy about hardwood floors and updated fixtures. BB actually understands my thinking and agrees with me.

BB gave me hope for buying the fixer upper yesterday. I have mentioned in my blogs that though he SAYS he can sheet rock, electric, lay tile and grout...I have never actually seen him DO anything handy. Well yesterday- we went to Home Depot, rented a carpet cleaner and cleaned our rented house carpets ourselves. Maybe that's no big deal for you experienced homeowners...but for the past 3 yrs that I have lived here, I have paid a company to come in once a year and clean our carpets. This year- we are saving for a house. We don't have $120 to pay for carpet cleaning. So we decided to do it ourselves. And we did it! It was only $40 and took 2 hours! I'm so impressed with us. Yesterday gave me hope that we CAN do household handy stuff!

And now when we move out of this house...hopefully we will be leaving it in the same condition we moved into it. And I can feel good about being a good renter. Since I will maybe soon have renters myself...I am improving my renter karma this way.

In other news-the other duplex we looked at that I LOVE!! dropped $7,000 off its list price yesterday as well. This house is larger, all upgraded, has STAINED GLASS WINDOWS, and WOODEN BEAMS in the ceiling..and a RENOVATED attic featuring a half bath!! All for 10k LESS than the other duplex...but its not in a good area. The surrounding streets are crime filled and the city projects are only a few blocks away...so sadly this house is not an option for us. I am so sad about that house. The block is lovely- all updated and big houses...but it's just 2 blocks of a GREAT neighborhood surrounded by crime...so we figured that for appreciation values- it would not be a good investment. I'm still sad about that house though.

You can see which house I like huh? Crime area house- I LOVE. This nice area house- eh. I like the area. And I like the unfinished attic potential (though a finished attic would be nicer)...and I like the potential for the backyard, the garage, the kitchen, bathroom...but that's a lot of work. And $$.

But I think this puts me in a better position for the negotiating..because I don't love the property. If I was negotiating for the crime area house- I would get really emotional about it. This place- I am more objective and it keeps me a little smarter. I hope.

And I have to keep telling myself that we are NOT BUYING A HOUSE right now!! I keep thinking about it and planning for it. But I need my patience right now. I want to see if this government first time home buyer package changes before we start making offers.

Ok, we worked out the housing issue...for now. Baseball guy (man? boy?) apologized last night for pressuring me to buy a house and he was proud that we "made our first decision together as a married couple." hmmph. I'm not to proud of how it was handled but I will let it slide.

Regarding the house, we decided we are going to wait a bit. President Bush has been talking about increasing the first time home buyers tax credit from $7500 to $20,000- and I guess he said he will discuss the bill on Monday. So hubby is content to wait for that news, and I have some time to relax and recover from the wedding.

I did email my Realtor asking if our opening offer of 30% below asking price is an ok place to start the negotiations with the hope of getting the place 20% below asking price.

My realtor said he does not think we will get 20% below asking price but it's a good place to start. I'm thinking that the place has been on the market well over 6 months and they only dropped the price 5% two months ago. In the last few months the prices have been dropping faster and faster...so if the seller does not want to consider our offer then we have no problem waiting a few more months and trying again.

I think we are in a good position because this place is not our dream place. Not even close...but it is the best place we can afford. The location is very good, and it has an untouched attic that can eventually be made into a master suite...but everything else with the house is PROJECT. My head grows weary when I start thinking of the cost for lumber, and sandpaper, and paint, and weed whacker and power washer...and on the list goes. So neither hubby nor I will cry if we have to walk away.

But I am getting ahead of myself...I did say we were waiting to see about this home buyers stimulus package first-right?.

Ok well- wedding has come and gone and the FINAL NUMBERS are in!!

I am not proud of the final numbers...but I am proud that SOMEHOW we paid for the wedding IN FULL!

Drum roll...final cost of the wedding...$23,630. I have done my part of keeping the economy humming along.

We started off with $8,000 in savings when we started wedding planning over a year and a half ago. Then I paid what I could as we went along. We entered the wedding weekend $11,000 in wedding debt but made back $9,000. After pulling a few thousand from the house down payment fund...WE HAVE NO DEBT!!

It's been over a year that I have been juggling numbers and budgets regarding the wedding...and entering into that type of situation all over again regarding buying a house just exhausts me. I am tired of debt. I am tired of giving people money. I am tired of having money in the bank but it's earmarked for something else.

For a little while...I just want the money sitting in the account to be sitting in the account. I'm tired of running numbers to see how far it will stretch for the next big purchase. I am tired of having faith that the money needed will come from somewhere when we need it.

I truthfully feel a bit pressured by Baseball man to buy a house right now. He comes at me with lots of rational arguments on why we should buy NOW (like this week)..and the only rational thing I can say back at him is that we need to wait and see if house prices come down a bit more. Or that we don't have enough of a cushion after we buy the house for emergencies. Then after he has listed his rational reasons why we should buy now he throws the last years worth of whining I have been doing about wanting a house back in my face. He gives me a guilt trip because I have been whining that I want a house and now he is mentally all ready to buy it and now I am pulling the rug out from under him.

I'm not sure why...but after researching weddings and doing all that work for so long...I'm just tired. I'm just tired of buying things. I'm tired of taking big steps in my life. I'm emotionally exhausted here. And he is raring to go.

And I HATE throwing this in his face...but it's MY MONEY he wants to spend on the house! He's not contributing a DIME! And it's our money now...but when he wants to spend it ALL in one lump sum without doing any research I tend to revert back to the "It's my money" mindset.

I went ahead and wrote an offer for my Realtor today to present to the sellers of the house we like after Baseball man wore me down. We argued and he just kept arguing his point until I had no argument. On PAPER we can afford a house...but I kind of think in my head that we cant. Well- we wont go into foreclosure...but I don't think he realizes how tough it will be. Because on PAPER we can do it (barely). But he's all counting on me getting a job and that extra income will be our cushion. I'm scared to depended on this imaginary income he assumes I will make assuming I can find a job.

Then he's talking about tapping into my IRA if I cant find a job, and I'm worried about counting on that as well because I just lost $25,000 in the IRA in October. 8 more months like that and IT'S GONE. Gone. Gone. Gone. I'm not even going into the guilt I will feel regarding losing all my parents hard earned money.

So that's where we are at. Maybe things will seem brighter tomorrow. We finally have his parents full support on this thing. Now that I got my wish (his parents realize we are capable adults and don't need to be babied) I am OK with sitting tight in this rented house...unfortunately I created a monster with my previous desire to buy a house.

That's my rant.

I know I need to start off my new blog entry discussing the wedding...but new hubby and I went house hunting over the weekend in our beloved city that we want to buy in (not where we live now)...and we found a property we think we will put on offer on!

Baseball Man is all set to go ahead and write in an offer...I am dragging my feet a bit. I know house prices will continue to go down...so we are going to offer 20% less than asking price to try and absorb some of the depreciation. The place has been for sale nearly a year and has only dropped in price 10% 2 months ago. We discussed that if we can get the house 15-20% off then we will always be happy with our price paid for the property no matter the depreciation.

HOWEVER...Have I heard that Obama is thinking of changing first time home buyers rules to allow first time buyers to lock in a 3% interest rate? I heard that there was talk of this. For Baseball man and me...that is nearly a $300 a month difference! ALSO, I heard there was talk of increasing the first time buyer tax credit from $7500 to $20,000. Once again...if that is coming..I want to wait to buy!

New Hubby is telling me those changes might be a year off IF THEY EVER COME...so I'm wondering what the likelihood is that I will be hating myself if we buy a property now.

I'm back & I'm MARRIED!! The wedding was wonderful. There were a few tiny snafoos that ended up making the memory books but all in all it was perfect. I have not heard anything other than compliments from the guests so I guess we dun good.

Of course it ended up more expensive than I counted on. I'm in a dispute with the caterer who charged me $50 per person when we agreed on $30 per person...arg.

And I spent money on things I never ended up using...but live and learn.

So I will be posting wedding numbers later today. Now I'm going to get started READING!! I feel like I have missed a years worth of information...new president, auto industry...and I don't even know what else!

I just logged onto my eBay site and there has been a bidder on my most expensive item!! I have listed this item, and a few similar items several several times before with no bids. Always lots of watchers but no one will spend the money...but today someone is feeling rich!!

This will totally throw off my eBay numbers that I calculated a few days ago but IT'S A GOOD PROBLEM TO HAVE!! Whoohoo! Happy happy dance!

Ok, stock market aside I thought I should go ahead and tally up BB and My October spending. I'll be busy with wedding preparations pretty soon and want to see how this month has panned out. Overall, I think we did well. I am pleased.

............September... October
Income.......$3354....$3977
Bills........$1551....$1166
1 time expenses$1216....$1064
Fun..........$644....$771

So we have increased our income (amazing because BB earned $280 this month-no really, he did.)and decreased everything else except fun. Looking over the 'fun' individual list~ BB ordered a Mother load of vitamins this month and that accounts for well over half of the 'fun' spending.

I am really proud of my eBay sales. I grossed over $1900 this month. Then shipping and fees took their cut..still left me with $1500.

BTW-everything was nicely lined up before it gets posted, sorry for the messy lines.

Alright...I am in. I am doing this. And I am not going to get out.
I actually convinced myself to stay in after my last 2 posts.

I wrote down that I can handle my shares all dropping ALMOST to the point of extinction- as long as they do not go to $0. I can handle that because I have faith that in 30 years it will be built back up. I was just really afraid that the market would go to $0. But after thinking about the market going to $0...I don't think my money sitting in some bank account will do anything for me anyways. Money might be worthless and crime would be so bad I would just be a target anyways.

And I have it in my head that the more shares you have...the more you will earn in the good times. I already have so many shares and funds and whatnot that it's a shame to sell all that and start over again.

And I am not a greedy little b*ch. Pardon the language but I always told myself that this money alone is more money than I ever thought I would see in one spot, and I dont care if it earns crazy gains because the turtle wins the race and I am already starting out in a sweet sweet spot. So as long as I retire with the same amount of money I started with-I'm ok with that.

And the best way to ensure that I retire with the same amount I started with is to withdraw a majority of my retirement at least 5 years before I retire. As long as I do that, then I should be fine.

And I need to remember that the stock market is not a net worth. Up til recently I thought it was a net worth. Now I see the stock market as a type of business...you put capital in-let it do its thing for a while-monitor it for issues-and at the end of it all you will have a net worth when its over.

I just get so caught up in everyone else freaking out. The news announced today that we are in "a credit crisis tsunami". -Well that sounds alarming! It makes me think that bad times are coming and I better prepare.

I mean, I have felt a tightening in the economy. Ebay sales are way down..the monthly interest payment in my bank account is pretty low..I don't have as much 'extra cash' in my accounts as I am used to...and everyone everywhere is flipping out about the economy. So I 'see' it...but personally for me-it's not hitting me as badly as I think it should. I'm just a bit uncomfortable. I'm not at the level the news and experts seem to tell me I should be at.

So I panic and think the bad stuff is coming. I think that I am on the verge of major problems.

But I need to remind myself WHY I am not on the front lines of this financial crisis.
*I don't own a house
*I don't own a business
*I don't have student loan debt, car debt or any debt
*I am not retired or about to retire where I need the stock market money
*I have not made any large financial commitments that I need to uphold in these tightening times.

So maybe I will get through this relatively unscathed. I don't think I deserve to be mildly affected though when everyone around me is flipping out. It doesn't seem very fair.

Ok I'm throwing it out there. I know you guys who are telling me to stay in the market are right. You guys have been there/done that. But when BA asked me to picture what the market would look like in late December...ok. I admit it. In my head I picture big trouble.

I worry because I don't think the market has really done bad enough yet. Everybody is freaking out and complaining and the news is going crazy...but c'mon- do we really think this is it? That the worst has passed?

This cant be it! We have had financial giants tumble, and all anyone feels is a range from basically unaffected to short term uncomfortable. We are not even in an official recession yet!

And the other countries are only starting to become affected with the economy problems. What will happen when the whole world is at its lowest point?

All I am thinking is (and this stuff is pretty crazy-you guys might laugh); The big American/ European holidays are coming up..and anybody who wants to bring down America might see this financial situation as a good way to do it...

Plus we might have a controversial president coming into office and who knows how many crazies with guns will get stupid ideas in their heads...

And then I think- this cant be it. THIS is IT? Unemployment goes up a few points? People lose their house value for four or five years? The stock market teeters up and down up and down for a while?

Everything financial related is uncomfortable but not unlivable?

We have everyone freaking out on the news, in the streets, in the political box...there has got to be more bad coming.

So selfishly I wonder...why do I need to be in the market when the bad comes? Why cant I get out and then get back in during the upswing? What are the benefits to staying in all the way down then up? If I stay in the market and my shares go down to $1 a share...I CAN handle that-I know that when I need the money the stock market will be all functional again. But in the event there is more bad coming-a lot more- is there a chance my money will go to zero and it will be gone?

Ok I don't understand stocks. I cant wrap my brain around it.I am about to knock out a few possibly wildly incorrect assumptions about the market that I use as factual. This could be a big part in my inability to understand the market. I am also about to throw out a HUGE amount of questions...

I try to understand stocks like house values. You buy one stock at $10. The more people want the stock (house), the more it is worth. The less people want the stock (house), the less it is worth.

BUT! Do stocks top out after a while? You buy a stock for $10. It averages an appreciation every year. After a few years its worth $200. yippeee! But how far up will your stock continue to climb? $1,000? $2,000? $10,000? I cant imagine many people buying one stock for $10,000.
People say to buy and hold..but if you buy and hold for 30 years wont your stock have topped out at some point? It cant keep going up forever..right?


And people tell me to not get out of the market now because I will lock in my losses. But I don't understand that either.

If I have $100 in the market...it tanks and I have $50 in the market and I sell all. I have $50. I lost 50%.

But the stock market will do 1 of 2 things. Go up or down.

Lets say it goes down. I pulled out as it was going down. My $100 was worth $50 when I pulled out. Then the market goes down some more. My $50 could have gone down to $5.

Then the stock begins to go back up.

How would STAYING in the market ALL THE WAY DOWN have given me an advantage over pulling out halfway through the decline and putting the money back in halfway through the climb?

If the stock market is going up and I put my $50 back in...and it goes up and up. How have I locked in my losses? As long as I buy in before the $50 mark...and when the market surpasses $100- I made money, right?

But what if the market goes down to 0. Then I have no shares to go up when the market goes back up.

I guess I am wondering...why everyone wants me to STAY in the market during the downswing. I can understand BUYING into the market in the downswing. Cuz your money has nowhere to go but up. But why stay in if your initial investment is going down, down down? Why not pull out halfway through the down and buy back in halfway through the upswing. You still will have a ways to climb to get back to your initial investment. The only way you will have 'locked in your losses' is if you permantly pull out of the market in a downswing. Or if you pull out in a downswing then buy back in after the market has climbed above your initial investment amount. Wouldnt pulling out during a downswing give you an opportunity to buy MORE STOCKS than you previously owned?

If you own 1 stock and it goes down then up- fine. you own 1 stock making money. But if you sell your 1 stock for a loss and it goes WAY down...and you buy in- you can maybe buy 2 or 3 stocks for the price you sold your 1 stock!

And I was In the market during the record highs. I was in that market a year or so ago. So if I pull out of TODAYS market going down down down...it will take a while to get back up to those record high numbers...I would have PLENTY OF TIME to get back into that climb before we reach the record highs from a year or so ago. This has taken a year to decline, wouldn't it take at least 6 months to get out of the red? So why would people tell me I will miss the jumps of the market if I pull out now? I might miss 1 or 2 jumps...but as long as I am back fully in by the time the stock climbs back to my selling point..I'm not missing anything.

I guess I wonder...if I sell when the DOW is at 10,000 points...and it goes all the way down to 5,000 points before going back up...as long as I buy back in before it hits 10,000 points then I will be making money-right? Why should I stay in the whole time?

if I have 100 shares worth of a $10 stock- I have $1000 invested. That stocks goes way down to $2 a share...I still have 10 shares...and I wait for it to go up...and it does go up...my $2 eventually goes back to $10 a share but I have only broken even. Everyone in the news is celebrating that the stock went up a million points but in reality I broke even. All the people who BOUGHT IN during the climb should be celebrating...but not us folks who bought years ago and just survived this whole ordeal.

And another thing...so what if my $10 stock goes down and then goes up to $100 a share...does that make me rich? I am only rich when I withdraw it right? Does that $90 I made pay me out a dividend or anything? Do I actually make money off the stock? I guess I can understand the excitement of a stock climbing if I got a cash payout every month...but I only see a return on my investment when I sell the entire stock -right?

They say the stock market historically yields a higher climb than a high interest bearing savings account so it is better to long term invest in the market...but a savings account pays me interest every month that gets compounded. It adds 3% onto the principle the 1st of every month and as long as I choose to compound the interest, I have a larger principle every month. I can withdraw some money when it is convenient, I can choose to spend the interest every month..but there is always $ invested earning interest.

That savings account money is an actual number. It is a net worth. You cant base your net worth on a stock price because it could be gone tomorrow. I thought the whole point in saving or earning money is to have security. Security to know you can put a roof over your head. To know that your kid will go to college. I can see how investing in stocks can be a way to EARN money...but I dont see how you can count your stocks as money you HAVE. Not until you cash them out.

How does a stock market come to be seen as what you are worth? How do you know you have $100,000 for retirement? Just because you had it 10 minutes ago does not mean You will have it when you retire!

But compared to a savings account once again, I get that the market on average yields something like 10% a year over the course of a decade or whatever that formula is- if I buy and hold the same stocks over the course of 30 years... but I never get to 'hold in my hands' any extra earned money (interest payment) unless I sell the whole stock. I own 1 stock for 30 years...and it is worth 10x my initial investment after 30 years...I must sell that 1 stock to actually have money in my hands and then what?-that's it. I no longer have principle in the market. My 1 stock is gone and it would cost $100 to buy it back. It would cost my entire 30 year gain if I decided I wanted to invest in the market again. It seems a one shot deal. I either own it and it is making money 'on paper' but I cant ever actually 'hold' that money the stock has earned me unless I end the game. ...

Wait. I guess the market is NOT like the housing market. Because with houses you can withdraw appreciation on your house (HELOC)..and the house will continue to appreciate! Just like a savings account..you withdraw a portion of the account but the account remains active and continues to earn interest every month. But not stocks. You are in or out. There is no 'being invested and enjoying the fruits of your investment' until you sell the whole thing.

All those years you look at your monthly stock report and see it going up (on average) a year...but that's not really your money. It's only your money when you cash it out. And once you cash it out-it would cost you everything you just earned to get back in.

Are these ramblings making sense? Is my basic knowledge of how the market works correct? I know I am only questioning the philosophy of the market because I am losing money...but the more I try to understand why I should stay in the market, the less I understand why I should stay in the market.

Have I heard rumblings that our two presidential candidates have talked about DEcreasing taxes paid on retirement accounts for a few years to try and help retirees who have lost lots of money in the last few months?

Does that mean I will be able to take my retirement funds out of the market and pay minimal tax penalties...then put them back into the market and later when I retire I don't need to pay tax??

Hi guys, still around, still saving. BB and I have been so good the last several weeks to really stop spending. I am so proud because BB has eliminated almost all his habitual spending, and we can really see a difference! Both of us have higher account balances than we normally carry.

I didn't realize how give and take our spending habits are. He wants some take-out food so he gets some for me. Then he wants a movie so he also buys me a movie he knows I will like. Then I feel bad he has spent so much $$ on me in the last few days I surprise him with a pizza. And on the cycle goes. But that has just about stopped completely.

But he did have a birthday recently. And on his birthday, budgeting stopped. He took the day off from work. We went to Cracker Barrel for breakfast, then we drove to his favorite store so he could pick out two new video games of his choice, then we finished the day off with dinner at the Cheesecake Factory (far away AND expensive!).
I must say that it felt nice to go back to our old lifestyle. Eating at restaurants, DRIVING, buying things without worrying about sales/tax/price...it was nice just to let go and refuse to think about long term consequences of our actions today.

I can understand how hard it is for people to go from a mindless spending lifestyle to a controlled budget. It was so easy, carefree and relaxing to just live and not think about money.

But! I think that because we have been living very frugally and watching our money- that we enjoyed his birthday MORE than we would have otherwise. Honestly, he gets pampered every birthday, but this one was one of the most enjoyable days we have celebrated. I think one reason was because in the past we have lived each day somewhat lavishly by going out to eat regularly, buying items as we wanted them- so when a birthday came up- it was difficult to top our normal lifestyle. We would try by eating out at a verrry expensive place, or getting several several gifts, but it didn't have the same effect that this birthday had.

The economy falling has been an eye opening experience for me on many levels. I wish I did not lose money in the stock market, but I think this experience might save me money over the course of my life. I have already gotten used to a cheaper lifestyle, and if we get into the real estate market soon then we might end up saving a lot of $$ due to this depressed economy.

Yup. Although this economy has been hard to digest for everyone- I think I have learned and experienced a lot that I would have missed out on ordinarily.

I inherited a few large antique pieces of furniture that I am not in love with. In the interest in adding to my house down payment fund- I called an auction house to see how I can get an appraiser to come out and tell me about the pieces that I have. I know NOTHING about the pieces other than I have been told it is an antique.

The auction house guy was kind of vague.He said he is not an appraisor but does sell antiques in the auctions. He said he will come to the house on Tuesday to look at the pieces I have and tell me what he thinks.

He did warn me that antique sales have been down in today's economy.

I hate this feeling of being uneducated and vulnerable to swindlers but really experience is the only thing that will teach me what I need to know. But by the time I have experience the antiques will be gone.

I know I will get low balled. But everyone is going to low ball me so they can make a profit on the sale.

So since I really have no baseline idea of what I would 'like' to get for each piece...I am nervous that I wont recognize a REALLY low ball offer or a decent offer. And I don't know if I should call other places and get other offers...I am just not sure who else to call.

I just got a call from someone looking for the Australian Cattle looking dog I found last week and posted on Craigslist. The woman said that he looks like a purebred and wants him. I told her I couldn't handle him and took him to the shelter so he could be neutered and checked over by a vet and he was likely up for adoption by now if she wanted to call the shelter. She said that if I had posted in the Craigslist ad that he was un-nuetered I could have "gotten around a thousand bucks for him-Even without papers." Well now I am so glad I took him to the shelter and dont have to worry about swarmy people trying to use this poor cast away dog as a breeding machine for their own profit. I could never sell a dog for money.

And a lesson for all readers that buy their pets from breeders!!! REMEMBER THIS STORY! I FOUND a dog that LOOKS like a purebred to my totally untrained eye-and some girl wants to breed him and sell the babies as purebreds!! She was willing to invest $1,000 into him (and who even knows how old he is??)-imagine what she would charge for the babies?? Go to the shelters, you'll get just as quality a dog it seems.

So 10 yrs ago the boy gets offered 100k to play pro ball out of high school. What does he do? He decides to go to college. Money earned: 6k is given to him to play out of college.

He plays baseball for a few years making about 5k a year. The boy gets offered 32k to coach college ball. What does he do?- he turns it down to keep playing ball.

The next year he is offered 40k to coach college ball. Nope. Still wants to play ball for 5k a year.

Then he gets offered to play ball in Columbia (the country)for 4k a month- "to dangerous" he says.

Then he gets to go to Italy to play for about 4k a month. No longer dangerous..but does he go? No! He wants to play in the states for 1k a month.

Now he is offered a chance to play in Peurto Rico for 6k a month and does he accept? No! It's not dangerous and it's close to home! So what now? His knee hurts and he does not think he will play well. So he turns it down.

Then TODAY he got offered a scouting job for an MLB team for 30k a year and guess what?! NO! He wants to keep playing ball for the promised 8k a year his playing salary gets bumped up to next year.

Jeezealou. It was not until I just got off the phone with him about this latest job offer that it ran through my mind,"He keeps turning down money!" Is he afraid of it? Does he equate money with lack of freedom, with growing up, with responsibility...what could it be? Why is he doing this?

So BB and I decided to take one baby step closer to home ownership and see if the price range we think we can afford is the price range the lenders think we can afford.

Interesting morning. I started off checking our credit scores (both our scores are in mid-800's good job us). BB and I were VERY surprised to find out BB has a student loan out in his name with a balance due of 11k. (paid up to date) BB's parents had never mentioned a loan out, actually they said they took an equity credit to pay both kids schools outright. BB has not been in college for about 7 yrs...so...hmmmm. At any rate it's a speedbump. The payment due is $130 a month and since BB earns 10k a year I can see this not getting paid off anytime soon and GREATLY hindering the lenders ability to account for BB's salary.

Anyways- that surprise aside- The lenders didn't really know what to do with me. Since we want to buy out of state we are stuck in the "you cant be approved until you have a job and you cant get a job till you live in the state" issue. Rather than renting in future city and getting a job- I was hoping to just get approved based on my meager rental income and my assets. Bless the lenders heart they were struggling to approve me but by the end of the phone conversation even I would be hard pressed to lend to myself.

So I got off the phone with options. I can get a co-signer (NO WAY!), I can move to the state and get a job (possible but not to practical), I can pull out a mortgage or equity loan from my rental property to fund the house (riskier and more expensive than I would like), or we can buy a duplex, and 70% of the rental agreement income will become a part of my income. This is the most likely scenario. We have been talking about duplexes off and on...weighing the pros and cons and leaving it as a possibility. Actually it sounds ideal- I am just concerned because the duplexes we can afford are in shady parts of town. But now with this mortgage issue...looks like that is the way we need to go.

I am just annoyed because I paid cash for my new vehicle last year. I paid cash for my masters degree. I am paying cash for this wedding coming up next month. Does that count?? No! And if I had not been Dave Ramsey responsible I would have 50% of my future house price to pay in cash!

Anyways, after feeling
really poor and unsuccessful in life I check my email and lo and behold- a lender approved me for 250k! What are they thinking?! I cant afford that!

My financial advisor called me today to tell me we had invested in developing market funds last year and now the fund has been acting a little wacky so he is suggesting I sell. I sold and put 50% in money markets and 50% in high yield bonds. Now I turn on the news to find out the stock market had a spectacular day today! Hope my selling caught it on the upswing and I made a bit of money. Didn't even think to ask him about that.