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money and friends

July 11th, 2009 at 02:39 pm

Everything here is quiet. It's nice. I am still settled and content with life.

I have a friend from early high school that recently asked me for money. He has asked me before so it does not really bother me- but I think the first time he ever asked me to "invest" in his business plan- it was handled wrong and I think our friendship was forever altered. Maybe not forever...but it's been about 3 years and I am still on guard when I think about him.

The first time he asked he called me up and kind of jumped into this "I have such a good idea...it's going to make so much money...my father wants to be involved with me- this is our plan and it's so simple I know it will be a success." speech. He caught me off guard b/c we rarely talk on the phone- I had not heard from him in a few months (not uncommon), and I was like, "ok. Good for you! Starting your own business! Whatever floats your boat!"

He continues to tell me that he and his father have it all worked out, and his father already has so much experience owning businesses that it is a cant miss opportunity.

Then he jumped into the hard sell, "all I need is 15k to get it started. Why don't you be an investor and we will just send you checks every month?" That totally blew my mind and I was stunned really.

I had huge warning bells going off in my mind and wanted to get as far away from the subject as I could. The idea he presented to me...did not appeal to me. I could not see much of a profit margin, and this idea sounded a little too close to a mainstream technique that is already in use...and not really rolling in popularity. He might make a profit- but not enough for me, himself, and his dad to share and realize this as worth the risk or time. Beyond that- his father does have experience owning several small business like a cleaning comp, a laundromat and I guess he was very very successful...but lost EVERYTHING over 10 yrs ago due to tax evasion. Since then the parents have really struggled to live and my friend has been trying to support them from his own full time job.

So I politely told him that I don't feel comfortable investing in a business, and I don't have any liquid cash anyways because I was saving for a house. He didn't argue, just ended the conversation and that was it.

After that I did not hear from him for a YEAR. I was feeling "off" about the whole thing and sent him a friendly email later that week and got no response. I periodically contacted him on myspace or facebook and left him funny or friendly messages and got nothing. He was totally ignoring me. Months later I was headed back to my hometown for a vacation (did I mention he and this business he wanted me to be a part of is over 1200 miles away from me?) and wanted to hang out. Nothing. No response at all. I had always planning to invite him to my wedding but because he was not talking to me I didn't.

Recently-about 7-8 months ago he just sent me an email. It was just a "I don't remember why we were fighting but it's all in the past and I hope things are going well for you." email. I accepted his "apology" and just tried to be normal again.

So catching up with him, I found out: his father had been diagnosed with cancer and had been in treatment for almost a year. Now he is in remission but the whole family is pretty shaken up. The family has a lot of bills and my friend has been 100% focused on his family and keeping things together financially and emotionally for them.

I just felt a bit deceived. Clearly he learned the news about his father and wanted to put into action a plan that they had shared together as a last tribute to his father. Rather than turning to me for support, or to talk- he saw me as a bank and turned to me for money. He was ready to have me invest in a plan without telling me the 3rd partner was not going to be able to participate at all- and he as the primary business man might be too distracted himself to even be able to run the business efficiently.

So I felt I had dodged a really intense bullet. I wish him the best but the whole thing reminded me why you do not loan or invest in a friendship. The whole incident is always on my mind when we talk, but I know he was acting impulsively and emotionally and probably doesn't really only think of me as a contact who might be able to give him easy money.

So last night he IM'd me. He started off with how he earns almost 100k a year to do a job that is so easy and he really wants to challenge himself. Aside from his govt job, He is currently running the businesses his father had re-started after the whole tax incident and earns "about 25k" a year from those businesses. And although he makes 125k a year he is bored and has a "really great idea that he wants to start and his goal is to make a million dollars in 6 years off an initial 50k investment." I saw where this was going instantly and just couldn't believe it was going to start again. I steered the question away from him flat out asking me for the money but he mentioned several times about needing an investor.

I am just annoyed because he kept throwing that he earns so much money (far far more than I currently earn from my job) but has no available cash to pursue his "dream" of starting this business because he gives all his spare money to his parents. It's noble to support your parents, but with his current method of having no organization- only giving them money is kind of throwing good money after bad. I look at this guy who earns very very good money and lives in an apartment, has no outward trappings of wealth and apparently has zero savings. He is living paycheck to paycheck- not because of his lifestyle, but to support his parents lifestyle. And they are not really getting back on their feet either- everyone is limping along. There seems to be no organized budget at all in the family and stretching money does not seem to be anyone's strength. Clearly earning the money is not anyone's problem- I do believe the family has a good work ethic- but a person can never earn enough money if there is no organizing where it goes. I look at small character traits like that and realize that being in business with this family (from 1200 miles away) would drive. me. crazy.

So that was last night. I am curious to see if I ever hear from him again.


15 Responses to “money and friends”

  1. Ms. Pearl Says:
    1247320464

    Seems like an uncomfortable situation and I would NOT lend him money. What he did in the past sounded pretty shady...got to feel bad for the guy with his dad being sick but he really tried to take advantage of you.

  2. Broken Arrow Says:
    1247324611

    Eh, yeah, your friend sound like a nice guy, but his "business sense" is definitely skewed. If you're going to do business, then by George, do business! Pitching something that "can't fail" isn't a business plan. Were it up to me, I would ask him to show me his exact business plan, and it's up to HIM to prove to me HOW it can not fail.

    Also, does he... know of your real life financial situation?

    Anyways, I knew two people in real life that are into the business of real estate. Or was. Both of them were talking about all the opportunities that are out there, and how basically, there's fistful of money to be made if I wanted to get into it. Both are highly intelligent and educated by the way (one has a MBA), but when I asked for their business plan, they not only didn't sound so great to me, both had elements of MLM!

    Huh? These are smart people, why are they even involving themselves in this? Suffice to say, I've heard nothing about it since, seeing how the real estate market has tanked.

    Seriously, if he wants to do business, he needs to prove to you how this will work, and as heart-felt as it is to want to give his father a sort of farewell tribute, that is NOT a business plan. Do something nice for people's family if you want, but risking them seeing that their "parting legacy" is yet another failing business is not a good idea in my book. Heck, the two shouldn't even mix!

  3. gamecock43 Says:
    1247325851

    I agree. I never heard a concrete business plan. I never even heard a concrete detail. Just heard about the business idea and what it would look like after its been successful.
    He does know my real life financial situation. I leaned on him a lot during that phase of my life and he was exposed to knowing I have a lot of money in savings.
    And now he is going through a rough time and needs my help as he tried to help me- but giving him money is not how I want to help him. If I did that then it would really be throwing good money after bad money being thrown after more bad money.
    Unfortunately I think he believes that this business plan is going to fix everything that is wrong in his family and doesnt see it any other way. I think he is really hurting and I want to be there to support him- but don't know how to show him that I care when he thinks that me "investing" is how I should show him that I care.
    I dont want to be involved in this business whatsoever. I see disaster written all over it due to his emotional reasons for starting it, his financial management skills, our friendship, and just the idea (restaurant type of idea)...requires a lot of time that I don't think he has.

  4. No Pain | No Gain Says:
    1247328872

    That makes me feel uncomfortable; and I have no money. I know you know this - but stay far away as possible. Looks like he's in it to make a quick buck...

  5. HELPmeFriend Says:
    1247333726

    Can I borrow money? No? Well, talk to you later. That sounds a little fishy. If he is doing so well, why would he need your money to make a million dollars. He sounds like he is trying to build himself up with your earnings. No thank you.

  6. Ima saver Says:
    1247345887

    You were smart not to loan him money.

  7. whitestripe Says:
    1247352084

    Hmmm. I have been lucky to have never been asked for money from friends - we have given cash gifts to a couple who are very close to us, (they have just had a baby, the guy had a shoulder operation not long ago, the womans mother passed away a few months ago too, and they have moved in with the womans father -they are not earning ANY money for the next few months just due to circumstances) but yes, I think if I were in your position I would have done exactly the same thing.

    It would probably be different if everything was handled differently. If you had faith in him financially, if he was straight with you from the beginning, and if he had been organised in everything to do with the business, then it may have been a viable idea. It all depends on the situation and the people involved. For instance, the above couple I mentioned, would be interested in going into business with me in a cafe-bookshop-art-gallery type of business - while they have no startup money or anything like that, I can already say I would feel 'safe' going into business with them - it all just depends on the character of the person, and this reflects on how they handle every aspect of it too.

  8. whitestripe Says:
    1247352914

    and yeah, with the latest ask, i wouldn't know whether to be insulted or disbelieving that he's called you up and gloated about how much money he makes, only to ask you for some. i mean, what the?

  9. baselle Says:
    1247363817

    I'm going to be a little strong here. He sounds like an emotional rapist. He talks to you only either set you up to borrow money or to borrow money and no communication from you is interpreted by him that you are in a "fight" rather than a sensible response to a phishing expedition.

    He's "bored" while earning 125K/yr? Tough. And while earning 125K/yr he wants to sponge 50K off of you "for a sure fire deal?" Get some of your own skin in the game, chump.

    Run, do not walk from this guy. Oh wait, you are 1200 mi from this guy. Phew!

  10. lizajane Says:
    1247376192

    Okay, let me get this straight. You were friends a long time ago, then lost touch. The two of you were in contact off & on, and then it was totally OFF when he wanted to borrow money and you didn't loan. Then, SEVERAL attempts on your part to get back in touch were ignored until suddenly he wants to borrow money again?! Lots of money, and he is making more money than you? Just my outside opinion, but he really doesn't sound like much of a true friend. Maybe an opportunist acquaintance, but not really someone I would think of as a friend. I think you are right to be on guard, and a very giving friend to want to support him, but just don't do it financially. Be a cheerleader, but not a banker.

  11. frugaltexan75 Says:
    1247436593

    I'm with the others. Don't give this guy one red cent. Seriously, I would not even initiate contact with him again. If he initiates contact with you, I'd tell him right off that you'd like to be friends, but you have no interest in loaning/investing money in any business plans. If he doesn't like that, well then, you have your answer as to whether he is really a friend or not.

  12. milehighgal Says:
    1247588765

    I agree with lizajane, you might have been friends at some point but it doesn't sound like you are anymore. Someone who you don't hear from for a year, and doesn't tell you about his father's illness, and just calls to hit you up for money is not a friend. I'd be upfront and tell him you are uncomfortable investing in anything right now, and see if he sticks around. Otherwise, there are other people in your life you should focus on, ones who actually care about you!

  13. asmom Says:
    1247922463

    Let's hope you don't hear from him again. He sounds like a user.

  14. fern Says:
    1247924681

    i agree with the others...he doesn't sound like much of a friend, only someone woh contacts you when he needs something.

    He doesn't sound very sensible and too gullible to keep believing in get rich quick schemes.

  15. Apprentice Bliss Hunter Says:
    1248025203

    This guy's behaviour is not the behaviour of a friend.

    Now there may be a reason for that - stress over his father's illness etc.. which means he is not in a good place mentally... which means he should NOT be starting a business....

    Also the figures just don't add up... how can he not save 50k himself when he is earning 125k a year ? Surely he could hold back on propping up his parents for a while if the business idea was THAT good ????

    One word. Dodgy.

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